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AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

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Mark Williams
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AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by Mark Williams » Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:18 am

Just a heads up as the Provisionals come together...

To 31 October 2015, showing a loss circa £600.00 with a current combined balance of almost £5K. Still to pay Insurance though which will pretty much double the deficit. That said we have spent circa £1250 on the lap counting equipment the year.

Fed Fees only brought in £525 a little down on the anticipated Insurance Costs of £650 (last year figure as yet to have 2016 quote)

Paypal Fees run to about £120 which we have subsumed this year rather than charging purchase fees.

Licence Income was circa £250, so potentially this sort of cost will need to be covered next year if Licences are dismissed.

Will continue tomorrow to formalise the usual summary sheet for distribution at the AGM....
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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by AlanGoodman » Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:00 am

Next year may well see some income from hire of the timing kit to Ringwood that we haven't seen before.

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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by dralphs » Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:57 am

So possibly increase fed fee by £10 to cover the licences
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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by Mark Williams » Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:05 pm

End of Year 2014 as enclosed:
BFPCR 2014 EoY Accounts.pdf
(36.73 KiB) Downloaded 96 times
Provisional 2015 Accounts to 1 November as enclosed:
BFPCR 2015 AGM Accounts.pdf
(55.14 KiB) Downloaded 103 times
I think we carefully need to consider the consequences of finishing with licences and the fact that we were down on Fed Fees that I always say should be enough to pay the Insurance for us to race.

We shouldn't be surprised to have run at a loss since we took the decision to spend money on the Lap Counting System. Projected loss to the end of the year would dip us under a notional 4K reserve for running a season.

Any thoughts ?

I would want the whole AGM Accounts pdf to be available at the AGM. If I need to print 100 copies so be it.
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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by AlanGoodman » Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:16 pm

My opinion is still that licences aren't worth the effort as they don't serve any real purpose - I'd much rather see Fed Fees increased as Dave suggested. Not sure if Gareth would be willing to carry on with licence administration if we decide to keep them - obviously if not we would need to find somebody else to do it.

Hiring of the timing kit next year should bring in some additional income.

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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by dralphs » Sun Nov 08, 2015 9:50 pm

Could you post a version of the 2015 sheet with the pending items accounted against each race so we know how each race performed please?

However If i have it correct, reading the two sheets you posted tonight

2014 loss of £729.65
2015 loss of £702.03 (if we remove the capital expenditure of £1,293.79 on the lap counting kit.)

That in itself isn't too bad, but we do need to discuss how we move from a circa £700 loss each year to under £100 or even a small profit without losing teams.

So we firstly need to cover £250 in licence fees. If the fed fee is increased from £25 to £35 (full year) or £20 one off race as was proposed in another thread, we should cover it going on 2015 numbers
21 full @ £35 = £735
4 one off @ £20 = £80
Total £805

2015 Fed fee £586.50
2015 licenses £211.00
Total £797.50

So for an increase in fed fee of £10 we should just cover the loss of license income, but most teams will see a saving and we have a lot less hassle.

If its not seen to be too big an increase we could even push the fed fee to £40/£20 but that might need to wait to next year.

Looking at the individual races as that seems to be where some of the loss occurs
it seems that R1 & R4 made a profit
R2 was loss of about £350 (better than 2014)
R3 small loss circa £100 (better than 2014)
R5&5 small loss circa £20 (better than 2014)
R7 loss circa £300 (lots worse than 2014 - why?)

Now i appreciate that some races will never break even for various reasons and we shouldn't base our calendar on what makes a profit, but if a race always makes a big loss we do need to look at either getting sponsorship for it or looking at the entry fee and check its correct.

Do we increase all races from £15 to £20 per car with R3 Shenington going from £45 to £50?

I think R2 needs to be increased to £20 irrespective due to costs.
R3 to £50 (as i think Jes wants)
R7 needs looking at why did it make a loss (if it did) and should it go to £20

I wonder if we can afford to increase R5&6 to £20 per day but offer a weekend package deal to encourage teams to do both days?
Dave
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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by Mark Williams » Mon Nov 09, 2015 9:05 am

Thanks Dave,
I'll see what I can add tonight re consequences of pending items.

Argument on Fed Fee was always = Insurance Premium / Number of Registered Teams in the previous year.
Say 635/21= circa £30 Lifting this further to cover loss of licence income is a bit off.

Lifting race fees for covering losses whether race or licence based I think is a better argument.

This is tied to the publicity issue. If we have less entries it doesn't matter how we plan our fees we will be down unless we race seven times at Solihull.

Curborough was down on entries this year (2nd least income over the 7 rounds) and outgoings had to include van hire to get the lighting equipment from Bristol (£150).

And we know Bruntingthorpe is expensive but that balances with Solihull.

I'll get back to you...
Mark
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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by AlanGoodman » Mon Nov 09, 2015 9:10 am

I agree the publicity/promotion issue is key...

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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by dralphs » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:34 am

I can see lifting the fed fee to cover licences could be difficult but i thought one part of the licence apart from age check was insurance.

For teams running multiple cars raising the race entry fee to cover licences may make them less inclined to enter another car and then sort out a team or run it light. I know it would us. Whereas a one off fee to cover whole year is less of a hit.
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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by Jes@GCRE » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:44 am

Hi,

Just to clarify, that van hire fee was for Shenington not Curborough.
Luckily we can run Curborough just by fitting it all in Alistair's car.

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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by AlanGoodman » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:46 am

If any other teams would like to help with logistics/setting up at events next year I'm sure that would be most welcome... Seemed to be the same folks most of the time again this year....

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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by Mark Williams » Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:03 pm

Jes@GCRE wrote:Just to clarify, that van hire fee was for Shenington not Curborough.
Luckily we can run Curborough just by fitting it all in Alistair's car.
Apologies I quoted Curborough wrongly. The figures do reflect the van cost against the Shenington outgoings.
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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by dralphs » Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:24 pm

So is curborough now approx £150 loss?

Still reckon we need to up fed fee to £35 (preferably £40) since it has been £25 since we started in 2009 so is long overdue an increase

And races need to increase to £20
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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by Mark Williams » Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:55 pm

Updated as requested
BFPCR 2015 AGM Accounts Rev A.pdf
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Re: AGM Provisional Accounts 2015

Post by Jes@GCRE » Tue Nov 10, 2015 11:01 am

Problem is, using "profit and loss" of individual races doesn't take into account that some of the "loss making" races have attracted new teams to the sport over the years.
Shenington has been losing money for year's, and it's bound to go on losing money, but a significant proportion of the current core-teams got into the sport because they were attracted to that one race's rather unique qualities.

Generally (far too much of a generalisation), places where you can put on something a bit different and a bit special will cost more money than places where you just turn up, race and go home.

Our race fees are very low, but it's about perception as much as the bottom line.

I have been e-mailing the teams who didn't race this year.
Only received 3 replies so far but none of them were to do with cost of entries, all 3 were to do with circumstances and logistics. Basically, most teams seem to hinge around 1 person. If you "lose" that person for whatever reason, you "lose" the team.

Personally, I would hold the entry fees for a year and go nuts on publicity.

All we needed was for Phoenix to do Shenington and Calow to do Curborough for example and we would be looking at another £400 in the bank.

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